Well, son of a bitch.

I have never come across HLLE before. Looks like it's time to do some research. Wheee fun.

So, let's see if we figured this out then. Both cats have HLLE. Both have been picked on by something, since the decorus has been through hell and back and euptera barbels are all swollen and red.

So, since both me and Wyite missed the HLLE thing, I'm going to go out on a limb and say that the folks that had them had no clue that's what it was and blamed it all on one agressive fish.

One aggressive fish could be the cause of the shell damage and the decours fins. Still I would have liked to know what it was.

Could be an aggressive fish with the turtle. I'm no turtle expert but I'm guessing that poor nutrition and poor water quality (which are thought to be causes of HLLE) could also cause the shell problems seen on the turtle.

It seems like all the puzzle pieces are fitting into place now.

The three other Africans all are looking just fine. Quite the epiphany you had there at the Petco Wyite. The sort where the manager hides the next time they see you come in the store. Also, did anyone else cringe some when they got to the 'snap' in said epiphany?

Anyway the Slider was being much more cooperative tonight, and I got to fully check out her neck thanks to the power of chicken. I'm thinking she was either a recent addition, they had more than one, was found or was given to them. The neck marks look to be damage from an overly aggressive male turtle trying to mate.

Still on the fence about the cause of the shell damage. We had one slider that was kept with a big Oscar that had some similar looking marks. If she was a recent addition that could be from anything though.

At this point though I'm just happy it seems we got most everything figured out. I'm going to move out the Africans, see how the two cats feel about having a tank to themselves, and start treating them with the usual HITH treatment that's worked good on Oscars I've seen with it.

Hopefully it will work just fine. I've never seen the HLLE variant of HITH. I definitely want to read up on it more, to see what the difference is between the two, but quick looking tonight there doesn't seem to be much.

Either which way, awesome catch on the creeping crud D thanks. You too Wyite.

Well, looks like this is about wrapped up....and wyite did they really make you buy the net...wow. I have found salt to also aid in helping along with whatever meds you are using.

Wow! She snapped the pectoral fin...some people are just clueless.

Your idea does make sense, Wyite. It WAS probably a bit of HLLE and another fish picking on it combined to cause the damage to these fish.

SF, I believe HITH and HLLE are both the same thing. HLLE is the latter stages of HITH. If HITH is treated or the cause of the HITH is remedied there will not be any lateral line erosion. That's my take on it anyway.

Seems like you're right from what I was reading on it, D. I've just been lucky and never seen it get that bad before now.

My usual treatment for oscars with hith is to

-Crank the heat to 80ish.
-30% water changes every other day
-1 tbs salt to every 5ish gallons of water.

Normally, with Oscars I have to get them off eating feeders too, but I'll have to see if I can pick up some food with extra vitamins in it. Since feeders are crap for nutrition I've found that getting the fish on a good pellet helps too.

If that doesn't help any I guess I can try treating for Hexamita since that's the other potential cause of HITH. Have to look up what takes care of that one though.

I would guess that the clean water and high nutrient diet will be 95% to 100% of the fix for these guys. I'll keep my fingers crossed for you.